The first article is food for thought, definitely. I generally don't think that escapism is bad as long as it's not constant, but if it is constant, who knows.

The responses to the second article amused me, because all of them missed the point that heterosexual sex does not necessarily mean reproduction.

ShatteredMirror wrote:

The first article is food for thought, definitely. I generally don't think that escapism is bad as long as it's not constant, but if it is constant, who knows.

The responses to the second article amused me, because all of them missed the point that heterosexual sex does not necessarily mean reproduction.

Yeah.. If it's constant, I'd worry. I'm not even sure if the artwork the children are doing reflects that behavior, or if the children are just adapting and being more optimistic.

Oh, word. Even if I was in a heterosexual relationship, I wouldn't reproduce. Sex isn't just about teh babiez.

Hiraku wrote:

Well, for the first article, it's like the kids from the concentration camp during World War II. They're dying, but they're drawing butterflies (studied about that in Middle School). Maybe it's not an escape. Maybe it's a yearning for a happier future. Whether or not it happens is another story.

As for the second article... I just want to tell those people... give it a rest... Just because the majority prefers the company of opposite sex and has no blood relations to each other whatsoever doesn't mean gays or incests or polygamy should be viewed as if they're disease or abomination. How would they like it if one day, the "minorities" rise up and make heterosexual, non-family related couples illegal?

That's a good point. I certainly hope that is it. Although, I guess you really can't tell unless you interview the children about their artwork, and observe their responses.

Now that would be amusing.

dollface wrote:

The second article was really interesting. Why do we live in such a xenophobic country? Why are we afraid of something that is different? If you ask me, love is love. It doesn't have eyes. It can't tell if you're man or woman, black or white, stranger of sister. I'm not trying to promote incest, but I did always wonder why in reality people are so much more opposed to it than they are homosexuality. They aren't the same thing, and I'm not suggesting that they are, but it is something to contemplate. If I fell in love with my best friend, it would be "morally wrong", but I could be accepted by some people, and I could even be wed. If I fell in love with my brother, it would be "morally wrong", very very VERY few people would accept me, and there is no way in hell I could get married. Incest can cause birth defects, but if you are gay or lesbian, you can't produce offspring. In society's eyes, I guess no child is better than a mentally ill child.

Wow, this is a really tough question. I'm going to have to discuss this with some people. Nice job SleepDebtFairy , getting me all worked up.

Kidding, I thank you so much for showing me this. And now, I'm off to go ask people!

Aww, I'm sorry. ..actually, I'm not. Yay! Let me know what people say.

As for the incest/homosexuality issue.. yeah, I've noticed that a lot, too. When I think about if incest is wrong or right, I can't really say for sure. My favourite fandom pairing happens to be gay and incest, but they're.. a really different case. And I also like Miki/Kozue. But, besides that.. I guess the main issue with incest isn't the birth defects. After all, not every heterosexual couple has babies, and some incestuous couples are homosexual and can't have babies. And the risk of birth defects with incestuous couples isn't as high as people think.

It seems the main issue is "confusing relationships". If you start a romantic relationship with your brother or sister, than are they your lover or brother/sister? Or both? But what happens if you break up? Starting romantic relationships with a close friend is awkward enough, but.. wow..

But, in general, I'm not going disapprove of someone in an incestuous relationship. It's their decision. Although, I do have to admit, parent/child relationships would squick me a lot..

Last edited by SleepDebtFairy (04-03-2007 06:25:18 PM)

SleepDebtFairy wrote:

As for the incest/homosexuality issue.. yeah, I've noticed that a lot, too. When I think about if incest is wrong or right, I can't really say for sure. My favourite fandom pairing happens to be gay and incest, but they're.. a really different case. And I also like Miki/Kozue. But, besides that.. I guess the main issue with incest isn't the birth defects. After all, not every heterosexual couple has babies, and some incestuous couples are homosexual and can't have babies. And the risk of birth defects with incestuous couples isn't as high as people think.

It seems the main issue is "confusing relationships". If you start a romantic relationship with your brother or sister, than are they your lover or brother/sister? Or both? But what happens if you break up? Starting romantic relationships with a close friend is awkward enough, but.. wow..

But, in general, I'm not going disapprove of someone in an incestuous relationship. It's their decision. Although, I do have to admit, parent/child relationships would squick me a lot..

You know, the morality of incest isn't something I've ever thought about, yet it's a topic that deserves thought.  I think we can dismiss the birth defects issue out of hand; people who get cheesed off about incest would still get cheesed off if the participants were using protection.  I'm also not fond of the "God says it's wrong" line of argument.  That pretty much leaves the "confusing relationships" issue.

I think I agree with SleepDebtFairy.  Sleeping with your boss sets off power struggles galore and makes breaking up very complicated; I can only imagine that sleeping with your brother or sister would get even more complicated, and could easily screw up the whole family unit.  I don't see why it should be called morally wrong, though, just a Very Bad Idea.  Sleeping with your child falls more in the morally wrong column; it bears a striking resemblance to a certain variety of rape, in that it's a forced choice for the child.  Sleeping with a cousin... honestly, if you're not living as siblings, I don't see the problem.

Anyway, I should probably post a link to an article, huh?  http://www.episcopalchurch.org/3577_84148_ENG_HTM.htm

I'll summarize.  The Episcopalian Church, aka the American affiliate of the Anglican Church, is run in part by the House of Bishops.  That House assembled a couple weeks ago and issued a proclamation that the international Anglican Church is not happy with.  To wit:

"We proclaim the Gospel of what God has done and is doing in Christ, of the dignity of every human being, and of justice, compassion, and peace. We proclaim the Gospel that in Christ there is no Jew or Greek, no male or female, no slave or free. We proclaim the Gospel that in Christ all God's children, including women, are full and equal participants in the life of Christ's Church. We proclaim the Gospel that in Christ all God's children, including gay and lesbian persons, are full and equal participants in the life of Christ's Church. We proclaim the Gospel that stands against any violence, including violence done to women and children as well as those who are persecuted because of their differences, often in the name of God. The (Primates') Communiqué is distressingly silent on this subject. And, contrary to the way (others) have represented us, we proclaim a Gospel that welcomes diversity of thought and encourages free and open theological debate as a way of seeking God's truth. If that means that others reject us and communion with us, as some have already done, we must with great regret and sorrow accept their decision."

Made my day when I saw it

satyreyes wrote:

You know, the morality of incest isn't something I've ever thought about, yet it's a topic that deserves thought.  I think we can dismiss the birth defects issue out of hand; people who get cheesed off about incest would still get cheesed off if the participants were using protection.  I'm also not fond of the "God says it's wrong" line of argument.  That pretty much leaves the "confusing relationships" issue.

I think I agree with SleepDebtFairy.  Sleeping with your boss sets off power struggles galore and makes breaking up very complicated; I can only imagine that sleeping with your brother or sister would get even more complicated, and could easily screw up the whole family unit.  I don't see why it should be called morally wrong, though, just a Very Bad Idea.  Sleeping with your child falls more in the morally wrong column; it bears a striking resemblance to a certain variety of rape, in that it's a forced choice for the child.  Sleeping with a cousin... honestly, if you're not living as siblings, I don't see the problem.

The birth defects argument usually seems like just an excuse people use, and the "God says it is wrong" argument doesn't hold any water to me - in the bible, if Adam and Eve were the first man and woman, wouldn't their children have to make offspring with each other too?

But, yes. The confusing relationships thing is very tricky and dangerous. Although, I think it's more of a problem with siblings and cousins you're raised with. Siblings and cousins you're raised apart from.. well, they would biologically be related to you, but they wouldn't *seem* like it as much.

I've also heard somewhere that we tend to not become sexually attracted to people we were raised with when we were children. Such as our siblings, and even childhood friends. This generally seems true.. probably to prevent confusing relationships by becoming sexually attracted to a sibling?

There's an example I can think of for that. I have a few cousins, and one of them is a male who's a year older than me. I only see my cousins about once every few years. I happened to have thought my cousin was attractive. (Although, nothing more than that. We don't really have anything in common) Shouldn't I not think that if I'm related to him? The answer is that I can still find him attractive because I was never raised with him, so I never really associated family-like feelings to him other than my mom telling me that he's my cousin.

satyreyes wrote:

"We proclaim the Gospel of what God has done and is doing in Christ, of the dignity of every human being, and of justice, compassion, and peace. We proclaim the Gospel that in Christ there is no Jew or Greek, no male or female, no slave or free. We proclaim the Gospel that in Christ all God's children, including women, are full and equal participants in the life of Christ's Church. We proclaim the Gospel that in Christ all God's children, including gay and lesbian persons, are full and equal participants in the life of Christ's Church. We proclaim the Gospel that stands against any violence, including violence done to women and children as well as those who are persecuted because of their differences, often in the name of God. The (Primates') Communiqué is distressingly silent on this subject. And, contrary to the way (others) have represented us, we proclaim a Gospel that welcomes diversity of thought and encourages free and open theological debate as a way of seeking God's truth. If that means that others reject us and communion with us, as some have already done, we must with great regret and sorrow accept their decision."

Made my day when I saw it

That makes me smile too. It makes me happy that when I was a Christian, I was an Episcopalian. (The "laid-back Catholics", or something like that, if I remember correctly) I really wish there were more Christians like that who would follow the example of love and peace that Jesus promotes.

Personal_IceQueen wrote:

Kids are fucking crazy:
http://www.kirotv.com/news/11455887/detail.html

I've always wanted my 3rd grade elementary teacher to call in sick, but I would never be the actual cause of it.

Oh.. wow. That's scary. If I was a teacher, I don't think I would want to share my lethal allergies with my students.

I have a kooky Biology lab teacher, and he always tells his class every semester about his lethal perfume allergies - especially vanilla. I hope a student doesn't want to get back at him for their grades by wearing a bunch of vanilla perfume to class.

Here are some  articles my girlfriend showed me:

"Police: Day-Care Owner's Husband Is Molester"
http://www.kirotv.com/news/11519126/detail.html

That makes me so sad and scared.. some of the children couldn't even talk!

"Police: Woman Posed As Teenage Boy, Lived With Girl"
http://www.kirotv.com/news/11518163/detail.html

Wow. She must have been one of those really young, boyish looking women..


I wish I could find an article on how scientists made a sheep that was 15% human or something.

The sheep was made in China, if I recall correctly. Don't know where the article is.

satyreyes wrote:

Anyway, I should probably post a link to an article, huh?  http://www.episcopalchurch.org/3577_84148_ENG_HTM.htm

I'll summarize.  The Episcopalian Church, aka the American affiliate of the Anglican Church, is run in part by the House of Bishops.  That House assembled a couple weeks ago and issued a proclamation that the international Anglican Church is not happy with.  To wit:

"We proclaim the Gospel of what God has done and is doing in Christ, of the dignity of every human being, and of justice, compassion, and peace. We proclaim the Gospel that in Christ there is no Jew or Greek, no male or female, no slave or free. We proclaim the Gospel that in Christ all God's children, including women, are full and equal participants in the life of Christ's Church. We proclaim the Gospel that in Christ all God's children, including gay and lesbian persons, are full and equal participants in the life of Christ's Church. We proclaim the Gospel that stands against any violence, including violence done to women and children as well as those who are persecuted because of their differences, often in the name of God. The (Primates') Communiqué is distressingly silent on this subject. And, contrary to the way (others) have represented us, we proclaim a Gospel that welcomes diversity of thought and encourages free and open theological debate as a way of seeking God's truth. If that means that others reject us and communion with us, as some have already done, we must with great regret and sorrow accept their decision."

Made my day when I saw it

And that is why I'm an Episcopalian. Thanks for the bringing that up!

morosemocha wrote:

Okay, the David and Goliath crap has always torked me 'cause I think it's stupid. BUT THIS PISSES ME THE FUCK OFF.



R.K.Milholland recently posted this on his front page. TODD GOLDMAN IS A FUCKING ART THIEF.

Please, please, please boycott his "work", and pass this along to everyone that you know. Please!



Edit:
Apparantly Dave Kelly posted on the Something Awful forums as well.

KILL THIS FUCKING FUCKER. Seriously, nothing makes me froth at the mouth worse then art thieves. It's vile and shitty and a crappy crappy thing to do.

That's a "little" too obvoius, isn't it? How can he find it in his heart to do something like this

On another note, this is the latest update I found in Iraq War...

I could've sworn the government promised us to withdraw LAST YEAR, but okay. I kinda stopped caring... which is bad.

http://www.dailytimes.com.pk/default.as … 2007_pg4_1

morosemocha wrote:

Hiraku wrote:

That's a "little" too obvoius, isn't it? How can he find it in his heart to do something like this

BECAUSE HE'S A HACK AND DESERVES TO FUCKING DIE.


Srsly, tho, I've given up on ever hearing anything decent about Iraq.

We should send Todd Goldman there.

Even with 50 machineguns strapped to him, I don't think he'll last a week

morosemocha wrote:

He better fucking not. Can we just tie him and Bush together? and then drop them right in the middle of the warzone? They're my axis of evil, personally.

Yours, mine, and my high school Philosophy Club and Democrat Club. (The second was JUST established the year when I graduate )

I think it's a damn shame that Tatsuya Ishida still can't get syndicated on paper. He's damn brilliant.

Meh. Charles Schulz requested that they not draw new ones but he never said anything about rerunning the strips, which is what they're doing right now. I don't have a problem with it, because Peanuts is one of the strips my mom used to teach my sister and I to read. She learned to read from it too, so it's kind of a family thing, I guess...

Oh god, I'd die to see Sexy Losers right next to Family Circus. And Sinfest next to Dennis the Mence.