CMK wrote:

(excised)

Maybe something similiar is happening here?  Or could it just be that the game is using something that isn't fully emulated yet?

Beats me. The only emulator I've gotten to work at all is Cassini, but even though it runs other games fine (albeit very slowly and jerkily, for me), Utena won't progress past the "loading" screen. I understand that SSF is the best Saturn emulator, but I haven't gotten it to work. I think it has more stringent hardware requirements...

Also, one good way to distribute might be to host a torrent-tracker on the EM server.  Just a thought.

Bittorrent tends to be rather unreliable and sporadic for me, personally, since my internet is routed through the college server and many ports are restricted. I can easily report that there are no problems ripping a CD image of the game, though, so maybe someone else can do that.

CMK wrote:

SSF Requires either a Pentium 4, Ahtlon 64, or dual-core processor, and at least 3 GHZ to run at all.  If you're not meeting that requirement, it's just not going to work no matter how much effort you put in.

Okay, I copied CD 1 and the files look intact. I just built a new computer with a Conroe dual core processor so I have the hardware. Would you mind helping me with instructions on using SFF? I have looked at several websites but they seem to assume more experience with emulation than I have, which is, um, zero. I'm willing to give it a try. Thanks!

CMK wrote:

Hmm...I just took a look at SSF and it's starting to look like something's wrong.  It doesn't look like it directly supports ISO images.  I have a virtual CD program on hand, and the required processor, I just lack a game.  (Any game, really, although in a few weeks I'll probably be able to pull out my copy of MKR for testing purposes.)

Is it a program I can download or purchase online?

CMK wrote:

Yeah, there's one called "Alcohol 120%" that'll do the job.  It's pretty easy to use, it'll let you load the ISO file as though it were a CD into what's called a 'virtual drive.'  Then SSF may work out of the box (it appears to have a BIOS-less mode) or you may need to download a Japanese Saturn BIOS...note that the menu options are not all that helpful from where I'm sitting, and from all reports the darn thing still needs heavy work and optimization.  In the long run it may be easier and more effective to just write a new visual novel engine to run the game, rather than wait for someone to figure out how to emulate the messiest pile of processors in console history (Not even the PS3 is as convoluted as the Saturn.)

edit:Visual novel, not virtual novel.

Hmm, the visual novel idea sounds interesting. Someone at work mentioned trying to use Ren Py. Cool idea, that might be fun.

I'll try the running "Alcohol 120%" but I won't expect miracles.

Giovanna wrote:

Just posting to say that at the moment you guys are over my head but I'm ing all over this.

Also I love that there's a Saturn emulator called Cassini. My nerdsense tingles.

But, but, you created THE FORUM and are therefore nerdy, techie TRANSCENDENT.

ShatteredMirror wrote:

Alcohol 120% has worked well for me in the past but I've never used it with Saturn CDs so I don't know if the different formatting (is there a difference in format? I was too young when the Saturn was around in the States to know how anything worked) might mess things up.

Saturn CDs read as ISO 9660 CDs, basically the same as you put into your CD-ROM drive today.  Stamping them is another matter, making an exact copy of one is a bit trickier, but it can be done.  If you create one from an ISO image all the game data will be there and a modded console/emulator will load it up, there will just be missing security data that serves as copy protection.

Hey, CMK,
You won't believe it but I'm playing the game with SSF right now! And I'm running it off the original game disk not the ISO. Wow. I'll see how far I can get. Um, my lack of Japanese is a serious hindrance.

Dani wrote:

Hey, CMK,
You won't believe it but I'm playing the game with SSF right now! And I'm running it off the original game disk not the ISO. Wow. I'll see how far I can get. Um, my lack of Japanese is a serious hindrance.

Well, so far so good.  A virtual drive is more a necessity for people who like to keep things neat (Personally, I have a tendency to let CD-Rs pile up around me if I don't keep track of them, that's why I use it.)  How's speed?  Frameskipping?  And sound, sound's a big one for a game like this, I'm thinking.

If you have the Utena Sega Saturn Game, this emulator will play it. The Saturn BIOS is built in which is illegal but extrmely helpful. Click the following link:

SSF Homepage
http://www7a.biglobe.ne.jp/~phantasy/ssf/index.html

Click the third link down that says Ver0.08 alpha R2. OLDER VERSIONS OF SSF WILL NOT PLAY THIS GAME. This will download the zipped file. Extract the files. Open the folder and then open the README file. Most of it will look like garbage because it can't translate the Japanese however copy and paste the keyboard commands into notepad and print them so you can work the commands of the game. Close the README file. If your computer is less than a 3.0 Ghz processor then make sure you have no other programs running before you open SSF. It is hard on your computer. My computer's temp jumped 7 degrees while the game was running but I was also surfing on the forum.

Go back to the SSF folder. Open the box icon named SSF. Make sure Disk 1 of the game is in your CD drive already. When you open SSF, it will open the game and start the Utena intro (which is damaging to the psyche to watch). Press the keyboard ENTER key to begin. You will get to a screen that wants you to put in Japanese characters. Maybe you are designating your characters name? No idea. Anyway, just put in any random character and press the "Z" key. Keep doing that until the game gives you a choice of yes/no that you are done. Pick the choice on the left and it will start the game. You will listen to characters presumably give their background stories. Keep hitting the "Z" key to advance the conversation. When they are done, the screen will change or you will be given a choice to act as the purple-haired character. When different characters are talking, the flower icon over the text box will change to identify the character (but you will recognize their voices). The point of the game is to rack up points with the character(s) of your choice. There are different endings based on who you like better. I have the Sega Game Guidebook and it helps with knowing which character will talk to you once you make your choice so that's a big help.

That's about as far as I've gotten. You have to understand the conversations to understand what choice you are supposed to make. Without a tranlation, I really have no idea what I'm choosing. (One time, I'm sure Utena was NOT happy with my choice.) I'd love to get this thing translated. Suggestions?

Last edited by Dani (11-13-2006 09:27:17 PM)

I know absolutely nothing about the processes involved, but I might be able to use my awesome power of thinking to abstract basic principles if I had a ROM for the game.  (I'm sure that other people, who know something about the processes or have even awesomer powers of thinking, could do a better job, but it would be fun to tinker with anyway.)  Any idea how to make a ROM?

I know absolutely nothing about the processes involved, but I might be able to use my awesome power of thinking to abstract basic principles if I had a ROM for the game.  (I'm sure that other people, who know something about the processes or have even awesomer powers of thinking, could do a better job, but it would be fun to tinker with anyway.)  Any idea how to make a ROM?

Yes, I will make a copy (hopefully Sega isn't listening) and see if it works (tomorrow, it's almost midnight EST). It's hard to infer what the characters are talking about because you are watching a still frame while they talk so you can't use expressions or gestures to figure it out, just tone of voice. And that's mostly when it's obvious such as Utena is mad at Saionji for hitting Anthy, duh! But the game quickly leaves the plot of the series so it's tough to figure out what's going on.

Well, now that we know the emulator works, it's largely beyond my capacity to help.  I'm no coder and my Japanese is essentially culled from years of watching anime, extremely patchy at best.  But from the descriptions of what's going on, it sounds like the next step involves someone who /does/ know some of the technical hurdles getting ahold of the game, and creating a new ISO image with junk text data in place of the data used by the game, and seeing if that works or if it just causes the game engine to go 'Bliblibli' with its' finger in its' mouth.  If it can accept arbitrary text, the translators are already in business.  If not...we're gonna need someone who has worked Saturn coding in the past to fiddle with bits to make a patch.

Hmm, even if it's practically impossible to substitute the text within the game (which would be SO cool), we could come up with a manual or adapt the Sega Guide Book to help. The book actually goes through every choice possible but I can't read it. It's scanned in the EM Gallery though if anyone who knows Japanese is willing to look at it. The characters are so small on the scans though. I'm willing to Xerox the book and mail it to folks.

BTW, thanks for all the help.  SO much appreciated. You are awesome!!

Last edited by Dani (11-13-2006 10:04:18 PM)

CMK wrote:

Well, it sounds like Dani's already MADE a 'Rom' (Actually a burnable ISO image.)  At this point, the trick is getting it from her to us.  I'm also willing to take a crack at this sucker, once I get settled into my new place.

The image is 402,102,272 bytes. YIKES! Every word of the game is spoken by the original voice actors. Hosting it on the site would be unmanageable I think.

Okay, I'll burn the image tomorrow and test it.

Well, we're going to need two of them for the whole game....although if this one follows the standard for the era the stills, text files, and game engine will be mirrored across both discs.

Fortunately, my laptop alone has enough juice and space to try this so if I can get it down over a hotel wireless connection I'll have something to do when it's not my turn to drive!