Holy fuck I just realized that I like movie touga more then cannon touga. Never imagined I would think that.

Aelanie wrote:

That's not really an unpopular opinion. Most people miss or overlook how manipulative and underhanded Movie Touga is being and cast him as a tragic hero, unlike in the series where it's much more blatant.

Admittedly, even I think he's better than he is in the series, but "better" still doesn't mean "good".

When I meant like, I meant is a better character. But still I didnt know it was a popular opinion... Guess Im just too new to the fandom

Last edited by itavin (05-09-2017 01:19:40 AM)

zeedikay wrote:

Would giving TV's Touga the Movie's backstory change him? Probably not.

I would argue otherwise. You see, if it was his backstory his motivation for revolution could be too break off his traumatic past as well as being the reason he is so homophobic and obssesed with women and sex, because, and you have to admit it in the series, touga likes dude's. to some degree at least, he does sleep with akio and saiomji multipel times, and was his sex pa... I mean his rose bride. Thats why when he gets to fall in love with utena, he is so obsessed with her cause she can pray hs gay away, and as such break free from his past life. If this wasn't his backstory then his motive or reason was to be a rich kid who got everything but the moment he got nothing he was all like

Touga wrote:

Im depressed cause someone is better then me

IN the movie tho he was more harsh on himself then in the series. There he wanted to die, because of his terrible parents and rapist stepdad. He and utena also dated probably to cheer each other up over there lost of parents, but utena became overly dependent on him, making him more miserable. He then jumped into the water to save juri, as she is the one women who wont love him, and sacrifices himself to not only become an ideal prince to utena, the one thing he couldn't be, but also to leave the adult world which he curses.

So no, movie and tv are very different. both in personality and motives. One is a dumb jock with too much money and one is a horribly depressed child who suicides. And in the Tv series if you change the backstory, He is a different person. People can have similar personality's with different backstory's (Shinji from eva and yuki from future diaria) or have similar backstory's or conflicts with different personality's (misato from eva and Rebecca from crazy ex girlfriend). Know you wouldn't call them the same know would you

Indeed, DD. In my examination of Movie Touga, I touch on that very possibility, although I tend to view it more as that he is in between being 1) a specter shaped entirely by Utena's memories and views, and 2) an independent being. He still has the memories of his childhood, things Utena could not know about him, so he is definitely the spirit of the Touga who once lived, and has active plans and weapons that even Anthy did not anticipate - but, as I point out in my exam, Touga died as a child, and never was the tall, suave, and cynically manipulative man he is in the movie. I think the case is strong that he has been formed into that at least partially by Utena's bitter and resentful feelings toward his "abandonment" of her.

Anyway, it's all in here.

Last edited by Aelanie (05-10-2017 03:59:34 AM)

I actually realized that if the movie BS was true in the tv series, then wouldnt nanami realize something was up. I mean, she is very good in finding abused people ( Anthy and Akio), and she stalks him when he showers, so she would have known right? Also that makes me question why her dad would ask touga to take care of her, or even adopt her, as she can be a potential viewer. It is nice to have movie BS in the series, but it makes too many plot holes.

Decrescent Daytripper wrote:

itavin wrote:

I actually realized that if the movie BS was true in the tv series, then wouldnt nanami realize something was up. I mean, she is very good in finding abused people ( Anthy and Akio), and she stalks him when he showers, so she would have known right? Also that makes me question why her dad would ask touga to take care of her, or even adopt her, as she can be a potential viewer. It is nice to have movie BS in the series, but it makes too many plot holes.

Nanami is, fundamentally a naive kid. She's crafty, but, she's... Nanami's egg. Cowbell.

Cowbell should tell you how aware Nanami really is.

Ok, yeah. Forgot that she couldnt tell what a cowbell is... Still dosent make sense why she was adopted but yeah, she is naive'r then I thought.